Please critique recipe - Here comes the sun IPA (Citra, Amarillo, Mosaic)

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by smchenry75, Jan 29, 2015.

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  1. smchenry75

    smchenry75 Initiate (0) Jul 7, 2010 Indiana

    12 gallons (split into two 6 gal batches)
    6% ABV
    50 IBU

    Malt Bill:
    • 2 Row - 60%
    • Golden Promise - 35%
    • Wheat - 5%
    Hops:
    • Magnum - 60 min
    • Citra, Amarillo, Mosaic - 15 min
    • Citra, Amarillo, Mosaic - 10 min
    • Citra, Amarillo, Mosaic - 5 min
    • Citra, Amarillo, Mosaic - 1 min
    Dry Hop (5-7 days):

    Batch 1:

    • Citra, Amarillo, Simcoe
    Batch 2
    • Citra, Amarillo, Cascade

    Yeast: Safale US-05
     
  2. epic1856

    epic1856 Initiate (0) Aug 11, 2006 California

    recipe looks good, but what are your weights for the hops, mash temps, water adjustments?
     
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  3. jamescain

    jamescain Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2009 Texas

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  4. dmtaylor

    dmtaylor Savant (1,125) Dec 30, 2003 Wisconsin

    Hop amounts? Of course you realize that the Citra and Mosaic will overpower any other hop additions. Also I doubt there's any benefit to the staggered late additions -- just dump them all in at the 1-2 minute mark and be done with them. In any case... it should be a very tasty IPA. Cheers.
     
  5. jamescain

    jamescain Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2009 Texas

    I disagree with that. You will definitely get different flavor profiles from the different addition times at the end of a boil. However, I do agree with you that 15, 10, 5, and 1 minute additions are a bit over kill. I would recommend maybe just 15 and flame out as well as a whirlpool or hopback if you have the capacity.

    I also recommend a lower Mosaic ratio to Citra. I personally don't like Moasic on its own or in large quantities, but it is a great supporting hop.
     
  6. Brew_Betty

    Brew_Betty Initiate (0) Jan 5, 2015 Wisconsin

    Try 50% Citra, 25% Amarillo and 25% Mosaic.

    How many ibu are you getting from Magnum?
     
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  7. smchenry75

    smchenry75 Initiate (0) Jul 7, 2010 Indiana

    All very good feedback! I don't have the exact amounts on grain/hops yet... I came up with this at work and figured I'd plug into Beersmith later and tweak to get appropriate ABV, IBU's, etc. I like the suggestion of 50% Citra, 25% Amarillo, 25% Mosaic... I will also go with a 15 and flame out as recommended.

    What are your opinions on my dry hop additions for the two batches (I'm going to split this)... and what about the Malt Bill? I'm going for a malty, fruity, well balanced IPA here.
     
  8. smchenry75

    smchenry75 Initiate (0) Jul 7, 2010 Indiana

    I figured I'd probably used the Magnum to achieve 50% of my IBU. I typically use it as my primary bittering hop. Rather than Magnum... would you potentially suggest that I get all of my IBU's from my late additions? Only con here I can see would be the additional cost for more late addition hops...
     
  9. SFACRKnight

    SFACRKnight Grand Pooh-Bah (3,274) Jan 20, 2012 Colorado
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I'd leave the 15 minute addition, and compress 10,5 and 1 into a flameout addition with 30 min hop stand before chilling. As for the dryhopping, simcoe and citra work well together, the cascade may be lost in the pungent ruckus that citra brings to the party. Maybe some chinook to bring pine to the party and cut the tropical flavors a bit?
    EDIT: with my hop forward beers I have been disappointed with the amount of bittering that is lent by the late additions and have been getting my bittering charge to the 80% of desired IBU mark, and then hitting the 120% total point with late additions. SO if I am trying for 100 IBU, I will add magnum at 90 min (I use pils for everything ) to achieve 80 IBU's, and add at 15 minutes and flameout for a total calculated IBU of 120. Of course I am not hitting these numbers in real life, but I feel it has helped get my IPAs more balanced and bittered appropriately.
     
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  10. jamescain

    jamescain Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2009 Texas

    If you want it to be malty definitely use a malt flavored malt (that sounds weird but I think you know what I mean since you have Golden Promise), rather then mashing high because that will add residual sweetness. If your beer finishes drier the hop bitterness will be more prominent. It also really depends on thee type of bitterness you want. Towards the end of the boil you're going to be getting more flavor, rather then ISO alpha acid bitterness, but if you do a 30 min hop stand at flame out you'll still be imparting bitterness. In other words those Magnum hops that you add at 60 minutes will be in there for an extra 30 minutes.

    For 6% ABV I like to target 50-60 theoretical IBUs since they will stand out more with lower FG. If you're looking for balance definitely load the back end with hops and save them for dry-hopping. I'm not sure what your plan for hop totals is but 6-7 ounces total should be fine for what you're trying to accomplish, even with out the Magnum addition.

    Good luck! Cheers!
     
  11. Brew_Betty

    Brew_Betty Initiate (0) Jan 5, 2015 Wisconsin

    It really just depends on what you want to achieve. If you got 100% of your ibu from late hops, it would have more hop flavor and less perceived bitterness at the same level of ibu compared with 50% bittering hop and 50% flavor hops. I don't know what your tolerance for bitterness is. Some people want minimal bitterness and maximum hop flavor. Others want a balance of the two. So, I can't make any suggestions regarding ratios.

    The flavor hops you chose are potent. If you stuck with your original plan of getting 50% of your ibu from Magnum, it will likely be a pleasant beer to drink. I think it will drink more like a hoppy pale ale than an IPA. Nothing wrong with that. As you drink it, take notes on what you want to change for the next time.

    I think the malt bill looks fine. The caramel police would be pleased.
     
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  12. smchenry75

    smchenry75 Initiate (0) Jul 7, 2010 Indiana

    Very helpful! I like bitterness to an extent but am going probably more for flavor and aroma here. I'm not going after a PseudoSue or Zombie Dust clone per se but something in that arena... probably somewhere in between an IPA and hoppy pale ale as you put it.

    I'm always tempted to add Crystal... but I've had too many IPA's that I feel would just be outstanding except for that "tea flavor" imparted by the Crystal.

    Really appreciate everyone's feedback here! I feel like I'm really getting this dialed in based on your comments!
     
  13. Brew_Betty

    Brew_Betty Initiate (0) Jan 5, 2015 Wisconsin

    I know what you mean about the ice tea flavor found in many pro IPAs with crystal. In my opinion, they are using the wrong type of crystal. American crystal malts tend to add more sweetness and a less desirable flavor and aroma compared with British and German crystal. It seems like the majority of American beers use American crystal.

    Don't be afraid to use crystal in a hoppy beer, but don't use too much. 4-8oz. of the right kind of crystal can add a nice aroma and a little flavor without adding too much sweetness. The IPA I have kegged now has 8oz of British Carastan 25L and it's not detracting from the hops at all. The beer isn't sweet. It has a pleasant toffee aroma underneath a wall of hops.
     
  14. drewbeerme

    drewbeerme Initiate (0) Nov 16, 2007 Illinois

    The grist is fine but will lack character. If you are going for hop water then that is what you have here. Why not get rid of 2 row in place of GP? Wheat malt will be lost as well. I'd consider some Belgian crystal malt 4-8oz and flaked barley for some body and crisp mouthfeel. Also, some Vienna, Munich, Victory, or special roast would add a little malt complexity without sweetness. I generally shoot for 1:1 OG:IBU ratio for IPAs. Like others said, perhaps too many late additions but whatever, it'll be fine the way it is.
     
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  15. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,807) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah Society

    @smchenry75 sounds like a tasty recipe. Let me know how it turns out. The best example I've had of mosaic, amarillo and citra hops working in perfect harmony is Knee Deep's Hoparillo. Don't know if you've had this before, but it's probably my favorite IIPA, ever:

    http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/23200/96037/
     
  16. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    Most importantly, I'd move the "10", "5", and "1" addition all to flame out.
     
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