In what job? My guess is that it leaves you woefully under-qualified for anything in the brewhouse, and it doesn't seem like it's necessary or even particularly useful for a server. I could see it for QC, but wouldn't a specialty QC qualification be significantly better? Then again I'm inherently extremely skeptical about anything that tries to hone senses. Honestly it seems more like signalling than anything. Being able to say "I'm so into beer that I spent time getting this silly qualification" could be useful for that.
Nope, because everyone has an equal opportunity to make the purchase of each model offered (with limited exception), no invite required. Not saying I care either way, but your analogy is flawed.
Server, sales rep, tour guide, or any other position where you interact with the public and are fielding random questions about your beers and beer in general. My local brewpub requires their servers to get the Server certification, it forced the servers who probably knew nothing of beer to study for a basic beer knowledge test, it helped a lot.
There's no exception, there are fewer cars than people. Its the same thing. Not everyone can own the same car, not everyone can be part of HS. Just because they aren't identical, doesn't mean the comparison is flawed. Your analysis was flawed if anything.
In other news, wait for the Bruery's "Wednesday & Friday" barreled Beer. In honor that the Bruery is now releasing 1-off OMGBBQWTF (also the name of a special 1-0ff beer to be released this Friday) special releases every week on Wed's and Fri's. Bourbon, Brandy, Rye and Red Wine barreled versions of each, $30, collect them all! Available in 25% blend, 50% blend and 100% pure forms. 4 bottles each limit, mules allowed, full distribution expected. No shipping.
I wasn't thrilled with the melange thing either but at that point no one knew that melange was going to be on the shelf fooorrrever at provisions so it was cool. As someone signing up for a third year, I don't want stuff that is sitting on their shelf, will be sitting on totalwines shelf, or that I JUST bought a whole bunch of. Its $300, man. I don't want leftovers.
8 pages of whining, entitlement, and trying to complain about Ciccerone. Ahhh the new era of beer geekdom.
There are 11 RS-exclusive beers slated for next year...if that's not enough rarity, then maybe the RS isn't what you're looking for to fulfill your craft beer collecting hobby.
To be honest, this whole thing is a joke. I'll admit that it is similar to the way a lot of wineries sell wine, but thats about it. It just seems that it's a way to sell decent/ok beer, at best, to people who value it way higher than it should be valued. I have tried several of the Bruery's beers, and they are definitely not worth the price tag. This is not to say that some are pretty good, but you are paying for the fancy labels and not the beer. If you actually cost out the bottle cost, ingredient cost, and other fees and taxes plus labor cost to the actual retail price, it doesnt add up. This just seems like another gimmick to get people to buy way too expensive, and overvalued bottles. It just seems like a way to get people to over hype a brewery and a their outrageous price tags. And to add a side note to this, California just changed its law to say that Barrel aged beers are not to be taxed as spirits anymore but as regular beer. So hopefully we will see the cost of these beers go down, but I doubt it. Edit: And if 50/50 decided to do an Eclipse Reserve Society I would definitely be the first in line to join! Because they definitely would know how to actually run a futures program.
A lot of people say the exact same thing about the Eclipse series...I understand what you're saying, but the Bruery is far from alone in this strategy, they're just far more direct and aggressive about it than a lot of other breweries.
I see more whining about whining, than actual whining. So I guess I'm whining about the whining about the whining, but really there have only been a few people who are voicing their butt hurt on this one.
I'm not offended by the name, and I doubt most people are. What offends is the idea of this group at all. Instead of working on making the current RS what it should be, you are clearly just adding another layer to maximize profits. In the future, either the new society will grow, or you will continue to alienate RS members who don't get an invite. If the group grows, what then? Another new society every 3 years to keep it "super seekrit"? And if you keep it the same size, yes, you will have diehards who stay in, but the RS members being excluded will become further alienated. This Hoarders Society is what the RS should be, and I would be surprised if the RS didn't suffer due to it.
I have seen a number of people have the same complaints about 50/50 average overpriced beer. I don't agree with that, but I have seen it said here on BA so it must be fact.
Haha, you got this edit in after my post...to be clear, I'm not bashing 50/50 as a means of defending the Bruery. Along with being an RS member, I buy Eclipse futures, so obviously I'm a fan of both breweries and their respective programs. I just think that if people want to criticize the Hoarders Society and/or RS (and honestly, there are some valid concerns about the Hoarders Society's effect on the economics of beer), that it's worth taking a look at the industry as a whole and realizing that the Bruery is not doing this alone.
I have seen the same thing, but the quality of their beers is way better. They sell great beer at a the same price the Bruery sells ok beer. So I guess quality is a good reason to have a high cost.
Nope, they are definitely not alone. But their pricing scheme doesnt match the costs of the beer production as a whole. It only seems like a way to gauge the consumer, and to see how much money they can squeeze out of them before they say no more. And the Hoarder Society might be that point.
Its almost like saying that $5 wine is worth the same price as $70 dollar wine, which is definitely not true. Eclipse is my $70 wine! Quality over hype every time.
I have no dog in this fight, but this is actually a great point that I had never considered. If I could pay for limited release beers online and then pick them up locally at my convenience I would definitely be willing to pay a premium. Making my weekly Tuesday trips to 3 shops and waiting in lines at breweries starts to get old after a while.
True. But just comparing the way they run each of their respective futures programs. And you can compare the quality of each as well.
Why would RS suffer? And what is wrong with maximizing profits in this way? Some people can't afford, or don't want that much beer that comes with HS. So RS would seem like a better fit for those persons? And if you don't like the Bruery, you don't have to buy anything, so there's a club for those people too. Isn't everyone covered here? There are many options. Choose the option that suits you best. I predict both RS and HS will grow. I don't see alienation. Does Costco alienate its members by having a gold card, silver, family, corporate cards? What about bank cards and accounts? There simply are very few companies out there with a one size fits all organization for their consumers. America is/used to be? about freedom and choices. Didn't get an invite, but want one? There's plenty of people here who did, but don't want to spend that kind of $$$. Post an ISO. Work as hard at gettin in, as you do bitching about not getting in (not directed at anyone in particular, this is just general advice to the group).
did you really post the first paragraph and the last line with no sense of irony? the difference is a little thing that people in the industry like to call "profit margin." assuming you meant "gouge," which isn't even used properly - you are aware that black tuesday and eclipse cost the same amount, right? it completely blows my mind that you're criticizing the bruery's prices but shitting your pants with excitement over eclipse.
" Does Costco alienate its members by having a gold card, silver, family, corporate cards?" ^^ not really the same, If Ruth's Chris said the Ribeye was only for "special customers" but... I could still get the Filet anytime I wanted, I'd probably quit going altogether.
I just have beef. Sorry for being OT! Yes, just beef. Yes, it's silly. Except to Ray Daniels. I think it's silly, and I sure as hell wouldn't need a Cicerone certification to get a job in the industry. The only people being helped by the Cicerone program are a handful people in food service. And Ray Daniels. If I truly wanted to get a job in the industry, I'd get a formal education, not a certificate from Ray. I am so damn OT for this thread. I'm a bad troll!
I disagree 100% with what you say. habebe had a lot of the Bruery stuff and a lot of the Eclipse variants. I will take a BT over any Eclipse. Point being is that your quality vs. hype point is just your opinion. We all have our own opinions.
While I disagree with the substance of your position Paul, I've always thought the apples/oranges thing as a lazy cliche. There is no reason why you can't compare the characteristics, advantages and disadvantages of different things. Lenny Leonard does it all the time: "If you ask me, Muhammad Ali, . . . in his prime. . . was much better than anti-lock brakes." For me, I prefer Bruery's futures setup. No rush to order. Guaranteed allocations. No crashing servers (well not for RS/HS anyways).
Like it or not, the industry is recognizing the program. Greg Koch stated that having it would definitely give you a leg up when they hire for several positions. He posted that on the old forum. -definitely off topic
I agree. In the end, as a consumer, we're provided with more options and that's always a good thing. For those who lament the Bruery's profit/money making motives, I would search back through old threads and see all the complaining by those who didn't get a chance to buy Black Tuesday in 2010 and the inevitable "Why can't they just make more of_____ beer?" Assuming they reinvest the revenue back to the business, they now can make more X beer. As with most beers, the "quality" is subjective and which is why there are a plethora of breweries out there that suits everyones needs. I don't think by making a blanket statement that "this whole thing is a joke" is particularly fair. For someone like myself who enjoys Bruery beers and also has no time to go chase down beers, HS/RS provides a very nice option. I like having options.
Curious if I'm the only one that's happy my pass didn't give me the "Privilege" on the Hoarder's site to buy? Cuz at first I was all like "Hell Nahhh! Seven Hunndy?". - When it was first announced. But then I was all like "Daaaamn, maybe I should. Cuz I do love me some beerz". - Trade bait. But, then after waiting to make sure it was NOT a scam site, I tried and to my secret relief, ......Login Error. It was like getting a total shit hand in a 9 hand poker game. Easy to walk away from with no guilt or regrets. But seriously, WTF!?! Am I really not good enough!?!
Hi All-- Interesting read, good to read all of the opinions on the Hoarders Society. I appreciate all of the feedback. I've been wanting to create several levels of "Society" memberships for awhile now as we have a wide range of customers with varying expectations-- those who have extensive beer collections and trade frequently, others who want a a wide variety in smaller quantities of what we have to offer, and customers that fall somewhere in the middle. I'd love to be able to deliver a great experience to a wide range of beer enthusiasts, and I don't think the best way to do that is exclusively through the Reserve Society. There are certainly all three types of customers in Reserve Society now, and I know we can do better to serve the particular desires of a wide range of customers. We could not figure out a good way to do this with the available "off the shelf" eCommerce solutions out there, and up to this point having a customized solution that takes a web development company several months to develop and continual maintenance and improvements is outside of our reach financially as a small, growing company. Up to now, we've been investing in our capacity, improving our production processes, implementing and improving our retail efforts, and in our staff at the brewery, Tasting Room & Provisions (now totaling close to 60 employees). Improving business systems and processes has been "higher hanging fruit", but at this point it is very important in the process of becoming the brewery we want to be. We finally have the resources to invest in this, so have so we've enlisted a local OC eCommerce development company to put together a solution that makes this possible. I'm very excited about this. We are tailoring the site and the backend processes to make a much more pleasant experience for our members and allow us to do a better job at serving our members. Even Black Tuesday next year (and perhaps this year, if we can get it going in time) will run much smoother with greater server reliability and hopefully we'll avoid all of the issues in past years. This is a sizable investment, but I know it's what we need to do. The Hoarders Society is a way to recognize and cater to our most loyal Reserve Society members, and allows us to brew and sell beers that we wouldn't otherwise be feasible to make by taking manageable risks with some very expensive ingredients / processes. The 5 exclusive releases included with the membership are very expensive to brew (especially two of them in particular), and at this point we'd have to take big gambles to create enough for the entire Reserve Society. The price we'd have to offer these beers would be well beyond our current top pricing, and frankly I'm not comfortable releasing beers that exceed our current price range. By securing an up front commitment and an established price for these beers, this is the best way to be able to make these beers make sense financially for us and hopefully make sense for many of those invited to join the Hoarders Society. Once we reach our target goal for Hoarders Society, we will not be growing it or adding a membership above and beyond it. Reserve Society is very near to the memberships we'd like as well-- we intend to grow it at a much slower pace than we have in the past. Everyone who is invited will get a card via "snail mail". We thought this would be fun and more personal, but given the timing of US Mail, perhaps this wasn't the best idea. There are about 5 invitees who may not be able to log in for some technical reason (my fault), so if you get a card and can't log in, please contact society@thebruery.com. I am fully responsible for the name, and I'll take the heat from that! As a beer collector / fellow "hoarder", I thought most of you would appreciate it. Similar to beer geek / beer nerd / etc., I think hoarder aptly describes the collecting nature of many of us. I apologize to those who think it is in bad taste, or think that I'm laughing at you. Trust me, I'm not. Unfortunately we had to have a method of selecting who would receive an invite, and that leaves many of our great customers out. Alienating great customers is our biggest concern in doing this, and certainly what I take most to heart in reading the comments. On the bright side, the Reserve Society will be much improved over previous years, and Reserve Society members will have opportunities at events for to try the beers we're offering to the Hoarders Society. I'd like to emphasize that we are committed to providing the best experience to both our Reserve Society and Hoarders Society, and we will constantly strive to improve upon both. Given how much focus and work we are putting into our special releases, 2013 will be a better time to be a Reserve Society member than any year prior. We're still a very young brewery that is rapidly growing, and we are not perfect and we absolutely make mistakes. Our goal is to make everyone we encounter very satisfied, and while we acknowledge this is an unobtainable goal, we still strive to do this. Announcing these types of changes certainly do elicit some negative responses, and we are listening and learning from everyone who has posted. We also recognize that we can't make everyone happy, regardless of the decisions we make. I recognize that Hoarders Society is significant amount of money. Is it too much? For many, yes. I'll be curious what the majority of Hoarders Society members say a year from now, but my inclination is they'll be very happy they are a part of it. There will be some pleasant surprises throughout the year that will add value to the membership, but we've calculated the membership cost to be the exactly the retail cost of all of the beer and merch we listed as included in the membership. Overall, I believe it to be a great value, even though the initial price is difficult to swallow. I want to recognize every Reserve Society member for greatly helping The Bruery to get where we are. Your support has been pivotal in being able to expand our brewery, barrel aging efforts, and overall becoming the brewery we want to be in the short 4+ years of our existence. I never imagined The Bruery growing to where it is, and I am grateful every day to be doing what I'm doing. Our many expansions have been greatly assisted by your membership and support, and future resources will continue to go into improving what we do and how we provide it to you. Our members support and satisfaction is extremely important to us. I will work tirelessly to be the Bruery I dream about and be the Bruery you want us to be. Sorry for writing a novel here, and thanks for reading. Cheers, Patrick The Bruery
That's not the same thing. Those things are available to everyone that can afford it. With this, people have to be invited. I think it's a cool idea to have different levels of membership, but the invite side of it seems like it could cause some dissatisfied customers that feel they deserve it based on how much they spend this year (which clearly has little to do with it, since I have no maxed out on a single allocation or come close, really. I have been a member for more than just this year though and am more active than most on the RS Forum site).
I am looking at the way 50/50 does there futures program vs the way the Bruery does their futures program. 50/50 gives a 30% discount on Eclipse when you pre-order, the Bruery keeps the same price whether you pre-order Black Tuesday or not (the only discount to the price of Black Tuesday is when you're a society member, but not everyone is a society member) Eclipse is $20 a bottle when you pre order versus $30 pre order, and then there is no difference when bought retail at the Bruery. Yes, Eclipse retail is $27-30 a bottle, but that is because it goes through distributors and retailers, so the price goes up because they have to make money too.
The Bruery guys must be reading this and shitting themselves right about now. All of this whining over a new exclusive beer club? They know their crowd too well; I'll bet there'll be more RS members than ever next year with all this talk and the Rues will be laughing all the way to the bank. But they'll also be able to make more insane new beers and push the boundaries even further, so it's a win for everyone.
